Curse

lyra_song · Jun 20, 2007, 02:28 PM // 14:28

This idea came in response to the "Why must everything be balanced thread?".

Basically its an idea to take existing skills, and modify them so that:

A) They can be tweaked for balance in PvP as neccessary.

and

B) Maintain usability in PvE.

-----------------------------

They can modify skills to have inherent anti-monster effects built into the skill.

heres some made up examples.

Decisive Stab. Sword Attack. This skill cannot be blocked. If it hits, it causes +_____ damage and bleeding. If it hits a Non-Ascended or Non-human fleshy target, that target suffers deep wound for ______.

Fifth Degree. Spell. This spell causes _____ damage and burning for ____ seconds. If it hits a Non-Ascended or Non-Human target, all foes in the area suffer burning for ____ seconds.

Richocheting Shot: Bow Attack. This skill cannot be blocked. If this attack hits a target with armor higher than 70, target and adjacent foes suffer ___ damage. If it hits a target with armor higher than (Put armor level of lvl 24 enemies here), target and all adjacent foes suffer deep wound for ____ seconds.

Do you see what i mean?

The first half of the skill is what is balanced for PvP. This is what is tweaked for PvP.
The second half of the skill is for PvE. This added damage or effect does not affect PvP and bolsters the skill for PvE.

---------------------------

Basically the modifier sentence is an anti-monster effect. By adding + damage or extended effect duration vs PvE only creatures, these skills will gain power without becoming overpowered in PvP.

To make sure it only affects PvE, the modifier has to stipulate characteristics that only affect monsters.

Such factors include:

Level: PvP characters will never be over level 20. So stipulating effects vs targets above level 20 is a good idea.
Species: PvP characters will always be human.
Special "Status": The equivalents of "ascension" are not available to monsters, therefore this kind of stipulation would also be good.
Boss status: A human PvP character will never be a boss character.

Of course there will have to be a few changes so that NPCs in PvP environments also fulfill the same status as human players, but other than that, what do you think?

arcanemacabre · Jun 27, 2007, 06:53 AM // 06:53

I dig this, a lot. What about simply applying the factor "Non-Player Character" to the skills? And like you said, the NPCs in PvP will just be "classified" as Player characters. Something like that.

EX:

Energy Surge - "Target foe loses 3...7 Energy. For each point of Energy lost, that foe and all nearby foes take 10 damage. (NPCs) Each foe that is suffering from a hex takes double the damage."

lyra_song · Sep 11, 2007, 04:46 PM // 16:46

I really think this idea is good...it got buried, but its very simple and contextually important so im bumping it!

More examples with real skills. Im picking skills at random here.

Avatar of Balthazar: Elite Form. For 10...74...90 seconds, you gain +40 armor, you move 33% faster, and your attacks deal holy damage. This Skill is disabled for 120 seconds. If you are not in pvp, your attacks also have 15% armor penetration.

Thrill of Victory: Melee Attack. If this blow hits, and you have more Health than target foe you strike for +15...39...45 damage. If you are not in pvp and this attack is blocked, it recharges instantly.

Winterclaw · Sep 11, 2007, 05:26 PM // 17:26

/signed but mostly for skills that were nerfed because of PvP... and 100 blades which needs some skill based component.

Onarik Amrak · Sep 11, 2007, 06:58 PM // 18:58

It could also make "Incoming!" usable in PvE. (In theory.)

MithranArkanere · Sep 11, 2007, 07:05 PM // 19:05

It has been already said. The way the wrk being different in PvE and PvP...

But... this has some problems... probably this would require to add all the PvP skills again as PvE ones... or making them to 'detect' PvP... hm... maybe too much trouble, now the game is... going iddle.

Lexxor · Sep 11, 2007, 10:32 PM // 22:32

Detect PvP is the easy part, already code in game for that (Can't bring your PVE skills). But basically doing two skills sets can be a bit confusing, while still trying to keep skill descriptions as clear as possible.

The added "If in PVP" text would probably be best hidden while in PVE outposts/areas, and other way around. Possible with a different color also to empazise it.

Cherng Butter · Sep 12, 2007, 02:37 AM // 02:37

/signed

sounds decent.

cellardweller · Sep 12, 2007, 06:11 AM // 06:11

The existing pve skills add the "use these overpowered skills or be at a disadvantage to your competitors" clause to skillbars which I find destructive enough already. Adding these PvE effects to normal skills takes even that vague semblence of choice from the player, forcing them to use unbalanced skills every time they step out.

I'll have to /unsign this idea.

lyra_song · Sep 12, 2007, 08:25 PM // 20:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by cellardweller

The existing pve skills add the "use these overpowered skills or be at a disadvantage to your competitors" clause to skillbars which I find destructive enough already. Adding these PvE effects to normal skills takes even that vague semblence of choice from the player, forcing them to use unbalanced skills every time they step out.

I'll have to /unsign this idea.

These "pve effects" are just to counter any nerfing that a skill may take due to PvP.

For example.

Searing flames gets further damage reduction to balance it in PvP. It sucks in PvE now? The modifier maintains the former damage by compensating for that nerf.

It becomes balanced in PvP and remains usable in PvE. And this also allows "crap skills" to actually be of some use by buffing them without overpowering them in PvP.

Then you would have a LARGER pool of usable skills instead of a few overpowered skills.

Elena · Sep 12, 2007, 09:26 PM // 21:26

Hundred Blades

Hit target foe and all adjacent foes if you are not in pvp this attack does +10... 22 damage

in comparison to triple chop

i would love this suggestion it would pretty much make both sides happy

as long they don't turn the pve side in overpowered skills fest

ValaOfTheFens · Nov 16, 2007, 03:39 PM // 15:39

/signed

Anything to end the emerging blasphemy of UrsanWay.

gremlin · Nov 16, 2007, 07:46 PM // 19:46

/Signed
Sounds good

Nuclfus · Nov 16, 2007, 09:51 PM // 21:51

/notsigned

I don't like the idea that I'll be playing one profession in PvE one moment and then when I feel like heading over to AB I'll suddenly have alternate versions of every skill on my bar.

When my favorite skills get nerfed, I either deal or I find new ones. Even if PvP is the reason behind it, that doesn't prove it wasn't broken in PvE. And if a skill is being used too easily against clever and intelligent players who should take more of a challenge to beat, I don't see how fixing that balance issue suddenly means that skill can't be useful against an enemy whose AI is too routine and predictable to compare despite its higher level. Take Searing Flames: it's still around in PvE builds, and it's still strong enough that when I'm up against mobs using it I still have to watch my footing.

MithranArkanere · Nov 16, 2007, 11:17 PM // 23:17

It's a PvP skills. Suh skills don't work in a different way being in PvP or PvE.

Triple chop hits once. This hits twice. That is, double damage and adrenaline.